电影｜贾樟柯：情感恰似身体里流淌的血液（双语）

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张译（左）和赵涛在贾樟柯导演的《山河故人》中。

“我总是想追溯人类在特定情况下，对爱、失去与死亡的反应。

导演贾樟柯接受时报专访，谈到新作《山河故人》的创作动机和拍摄中遇到的挑战。他说，作为电影人，他的职责就是用镜头捕捉人们真实的生活状态，无论是富裕还是贫穷。

The Chinese director Jia Zhangke charts characters from past to future in the decades-spanning film “Mountains May Depart,” a selection in the New York Film Festival. Mr. Jia was in New York in 2013 with another film about contemporary life in China, “A Touch of Sin.” But the new picture looks more closely at how relationships affect lives over time. In an interview during the festival, he spoke through an interpreter about his work.

《山河故人》时间跨度长达几十年，描绘了从过去到未来的人物，影片在纽约电影节上映。2013年，贾樟柯曾携反映当代中国生活的影片《天注定》来到纽约。但是《山河故人》更加密切地关注岁月流逝中感情关系对人生的影响，他通过翻译谈了自己的新作。

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What is your best memory of the festival?

I do know that what has impressed me the most is that it is very simple: It’s all about the films. So I like this very film-centric festival.

问：你对纽约电影节最美好的记忆是什么？

答：令我印象最深的是，它非常简单，一切都是关于电影的。所以我很喜欢这个纯粹以电影为中心的电影节。

What film would you be most interested in seeing at the festival?

I won’t have time to see other films. But if I were here for more than two days, I would want to see Apichatpong Weerasethakul’s “Cemetery of Splendour.” But hopefully I’ll get to see the film at another festival.

问：这次电影节上你最感兴趣的片子是什么？

答：我没有时间去看其他电影。但是如果能多呆两天，我会去看阿彼察邦·韦拉斯哈古(Apichatpong Weerasethakul)的《幻梦墓园》(Cemetery of Splendour)。我可能有机会在其他电影节上看到这部片子。

What was the most challenging moment in your shoot?

In one scene, the father of the female character Tao passes away unexpectedly in a different town. She receives the news and makes her way there. I at first asked [the actress and Mr. Jia’s wife] Zhao Tao to be very calm and composed. Because to me, that’s how you’re able to take care of all the funeral decisions. But when we were shooting, she didn’t really get into the character. She told me she didn’t feel quite right about the way I wrote the character in that scene. To her, as a Chinese female character having such an intimate relationship with her father, she thought the emotions should be very externalized: to cry and express emotions viscerally. It’s a completely different female perspective on how to deal with someone’s passing, and different from how I would deal with it. I went through a lot of internal struggles with the scene. And I realized it had a lot to do with the way I see, not only from a male’s perspective, but from the Eastern aesthetic. I decided eventually to go for the actual human reactions rather than the Eastern film aesthetic. I changed my direction and had Zhao Tao’s character be a lot more expressive in her grief.

问：这次拍摄中最有挑战性的事情是什么？

答：在一场戏里，女主角涛的父亲在另一个镇上意外去世。她听说消息，赶去那里。一开始我让赵涛（饰演这个角色的演员，也是贾樟柯的妻子）表现得非常平静沉着。因为我觉得这样才能处理好所有后事。但拍摄的时候，她没有真正进入这个角色。她告诉我，她觉得在这一幕里，我写的这个角色有点不对劲。她觉得，作为一个和父亲关系非常亲密的中国女人，这种时候感情应该非常外露，应该大哭，表达发自内心的情感。这是一种完全不同的，女性化的对待死亡的角度，和我的方式完全不一样。拍这场戏时，我有很多内心斗争，最后发现这和我看待事物的方式有关，不仅仅是出于男人的角度，而是出于东方美学的角度。最终我决定依照现实生活中人们的反应，而不是追求东方美学。我改变了自己的指示，让赵涛的角色更多地表现她的悲伤。

What was your primary motivation for making the film?

I wanted to investigate human emotions on many different levels within many different relationships. I wanted to think about them like blood in your bloodstream. In your daily life, you don’t feel it flowing in your veins, but when certain situations happen, you will feel a certain influx or outgoing of the blood to your face or certain parts of your body. I wanted to always go back to how you react in certain situations dealing with love, loss and death.

问：你拍这部影片最初的动机是什么？

答：我想探索人类在许多不同的人际关系之中不同层次的情感。我想把它们视为身体里流淌的血液。日常生活中，你不会感觉到它们在血管里的流淌。但特定情况发生时，你会感觉一股血流涌动到脸上，或者身体的其他部位。我总是想追溯人类在特定情况下，对爱、失去与死亡的反应。

How has the film been received in China?

The film will be released in theaters in China on Oct. 30. But it was shown in the Shanghai Film Festival in June. After that screening, we got a lot of feedback and reactions. Many loved the film, but at the same time there were people who really felt uncomfortable with what they saw being portrayed. The discomfort they experienced was that, even though the film is very much about the development and growth of the economy in China and how we are better off financially and economically speaking, you do still see poverty and what it’s like to still be living in an impoverished environment. So I think that part is problematic for some people, who think we should just look at the bright side and not at the underbelly of society. But as a filmmaker, no matter what country you’re in, you cannot somehow forget those people — it’s our duty to capture them with our cameras, and document their lives as well.

问：这部影片在中国的反响如何？

答：它将于10月30日在中国公映。但是6月它在上海电影节上上映过。自那以后，我们得到很多反馈和反响。很多人喜欢这部片子，但也有人看了片子觉得不舒服，因为尽管这部片子很大程度上是关于中国的发展和经济增长，以及我们在经济和金融方面更加富裕，但你还是可以看到贫穷现象，以及在穷困状态下生活的状态。所以我觉得这部分对于某些人来说很成问题，他们觉得我们应该多看光明的一面，而不是只盯着社会的底层。但是作为一个拍电影的人，不管你身处哪个国家，你不能忘记那些人——我们的责任就是用镜头捕捉这些人，把他们的生活记录下来。

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作者：MEKADO MURPHY

翻译：董楠

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