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专访宾大景观系主任|理查德·韦勒

GARLIC咖林 2019-12-01


 

第一部分:宣言 

Part One: Declaration


小编:50年以前,伊恩·麦克哈格教授1和一批先锋的景观设计师成立了“美国的景观设计协会”2(LAF)。LAF的“宣言”表达了对当时美国生态环境被肆意破坏的关注,并预言景观设计师将作为解决生态环境问题的主导力量。您作为景观设计理论思想者和实践者,请问您对当代中国正遭受环境破坏境遇的“宣言”是什么?

韦勒教授:中国的生态环境被逐步破坏。这需要景观设计师去团结政治家,社会群体以及其他专业的精英一起思考如何整合退化的生态系统和城市系统,来实现宏图。


1.伊恩·麦克哈格:(1920-2001) 宾夕法尼亚大学设计学院景观设计与区域规划专业创始人,他打破了景观学科的边界,将景观设计提升到了科学的高度,从此,景观设计开始向包含多门综合性学科的方向发展。其著作《设计遵从自然》(Design with Nature)是景观设计师和规划师的必读书目之一,自1969年出版以来,在业界产生了深远的影响。

2.美国的景观设计协会(LAF):美国最重要的景观设计师组织之一,在保护和改善生态环境方面做出了巨大的贡献。LAF通过对研究项目和学生学者的投资来提升景观设计师合作能力和致力于可持续发展的决心。


Q: 50 years ago, Ian McHarg and leading landscape architects composed the Landscape Architecture Foundation(LAF)’s seminal Declaration of Concern, which decried the burgeoning environmental crisis and heralded landscape architecture as critical to help solve it. As a leading landscape architecture theory thinker as well as practitioner, what “Declaration” will you make for China which is suffering the environmental crisis now? 

A: China is ecologically self destructing. It needs landscape architects to bring together politicians, communities and other professionals around visionary plans for how fading ecological systems and urban systems can be integrated.  



图1:Laurie Olin教授画的Ian McHarg教授肖像。图片来源:《Transects》

 

小编:请问您对习近平总书记在21世纪初提出的中国将从“GDP文明”转向“生态文明”是如何解读的?

韦勒教授:这也许是我听过领导人说出的最重要并且最简明扼要的宣言。


Q: What is your interpretation for the manifesto speech of “transitioning from GDP Civilization to Ecological Civilization” in China declared by Chinese President Xi at the beginning of the 21st century?

A: It’s probably the most important and succinct thing I’ve ever heard a politician say.


小编:作为宾夕法尼亚大学设计学院2016年京津冀区域规划专业课的三个导师之一,您认为中国最迫切需要作出怎样的转变才能实现习近平总书记对生态文明的愿景?

韦勒教授:我们尝试去寻找一个新的区域规划的管理系统,这个系统是从生态的角度出发的思考而不是从以往的政治角度出发的。在经济层面上,我们也在思考如何让更多的人能够参与这项生态修复工作。

 

Q: As one of the three instructors in PennDesign’s 2016 Jing-Jin-Ji Megaregional Studio, what are the critical transformations that China should make in order to achieve President Xi’s vison– Ecological Civilization? 

A: Try to figure out a new form of megaregional governance along ecological lines not old political lines and then try to figure out how to economically reemploy large numbers of people in the work of ecological restoration.


图2:韦勒教授绘制京津冀区域规划图纸。图片来源:GARLIC




第二部分:转变 

Part Two: Transition

 

小编:美国城市规划在历史上有许多争议,其中简·雅各布斯3和罗伯特·摩斯4关于纽约曼哈顿的城市规划和设计有各自不同的见解。您怎么认为这两种不同的规划理念将会影响未来中国的城市发展?

韦勒教授:很显然中国有太多的罗伯特·摩斯,相比之下简·雅各布斯却很少。我希望在我的中国学生中能出现下一个简·雅各布斯,能够用一种独特的方式应对中国的城市化,这种方式一定要得到广泛的关注。新的理论应该从城市的小尺度空间出发,并由此发展成中国的“新都市主义”。


3. 简·雅各布斯:(1916-2006) 她称得上是过去半个世纪中对美国乃至世界城市规划发展影响最大的人士之一,出版于1961年的《美国大城市的死与生》震撼了当时的美国规划界。

4. 罗伯特·摩斯:(1888-1981) 摩斯纽约市城市规划的关键就是通过道路、桥梁,把纽约与周围其他地区紧密联系起来,这样不仅方便纽约居民出城,也为乘车上班族和游客提供了极大便利,彰显了区域城市核心的重要作用。然而,对车辆的速度和交通顺畅的过分强调也使他忽视了行人的感受。

 

Q: The debate of urban planning between Jane Jacobs vs Robert Moses in Manhattan provide different approaches to urban planning and design. How do you see those two main ideas will affect the future urban development in China?

A: Obviously China has had too much Robert Moses and not enough Jane Jacobs. I keep hoping one of my Chinese students will become the next Jane Jacobs and draw to everyone’s attention the unique ways in which Chinese urbanism works at a micro scale and then from that develop a Chinese ‘new urbanism’.



图3:简·雅各布斯 vs.罗伯特·摩斯。图片来源:GARLIC


小编:2016年,中国城市设计导则有了根本的转变,从超大街区和宽马路的设计标准向小地块和适宜步行的马路转变。您为什么认为新的设计导向比较好?

韦勒教授:我对任何城市设计导则都持怀疑态度。中国的超大街区很显然是失去人的尺度感的,但我并不确定引进美国和欧洲的新都市主义的做法是正确的。我认为中国应该发明自己的都市主义,这种都市主义是从当地的文化特质进行考量的。


Q: In 2016, Urban Design guidelines in China have made fundamental transition from super blocks and wide street development to small blocks and narrow street. Why do you think the old guidelines do not work, and new guidelines will work?

A: I’m suspicious of any urban design guidelines. The super blocks are obviously out of scale and the streets are inhumane, but I’m not sure the importation of American or European New urbanism is right either. I think you need to invent an urbanism out of local and cultural conditions.


小编:中国的许多设计作品丢失了中国自己的文化属性,一些设计甚至直接抄袭欧洲和美国的作品。您人为中国如何才能保护或者创造自己的文化属性?

韦勒教授:相比保护传统文化,我对创造新的文化更感兴趣。由于快速的现代化发展,中国丢失了许多文化属性,但是新的文化属性也许会从你认为没有属性的地方滋生出来。


Q: In China, a lot of design projects lost their cultural identity, some of which nearly copy and paste the style of Europe and America. What are the essential considerations do you think can preserve/create the cultural identity for China? 

A: I’m more interested in the creation of culture not the preservation of culture. Of course there is a great sense of loss due to China’s accelerated modernity but new identities might emerge from precisely the places you think have no identity.


小编:您认为景观设计师怎样才能让他们从生态和可持续性的角度出发的创意设计中获得更多的认同?您认为怎样让景观设计师的作品让大众认识?

韦勒教授:景观设计师必须找到设计美学,这种美学是和大众文化有联系的。好的设计项目是令人兴奋并且吸引人的,它或者有令人难忘的形式,或者诠释出设计场地是如何成为大的生态系统以及社会复杂关系的一部分。作品如果足够好,认可和知名度就会随之而来。


Q: How do you think landscape architects can gain recognition for their creative works, which inherently deals with ecology and sustainability? What are the core ideas do you think will connect landscape architect’s works with the general public? 

A: They have to develop aesthetics that connect with popular culture, develop programs that are exciting and attractive, develop forms that are memorable and show how a site is part of larger ecological and social flows. If the work is good, recognition will follow.



图4:现代和传统的冲突:故宫和新CCTV大楼。图片来源:GARLIC




第三部分:基石 

Part Three: Bedrock


小编:您认为“景观都市主义”对中国的过去几十年的高速城市化过程相关吗?怎样相关?

韦勒教授: “景观都市主义”的含义是同时关注城市系统和景观系统。因为中国的景观已经被城市化,“景观都市主义”是非常合理的理论视角。中国的思想家和实践者应该探索出他们自己独特的景观都市主义版本。

 

Q: Do you think the idea of Landscape Urbanism is relevant to China’s super-fast urbanization process over the past several decades? and How?

A: Landscape urbanism means that we focus on urban systems as well as landscape systems. Since China’s landscape is urbanizing it makes perfect sense that landscape urbanism is an appropriate theoretical lens. Chinese thinkers and practitioners need to develop their own version of landscape urbanism.


小编:您认为景观都市主义的作品能在中国特定环境下生存吗?中国有许多集中的政府资金支持,这种环境相比于欧美分散的个体组织是非常不同的。

韦勒教授:政府的大力支持发展意味着景观设计师能够在更大尺度上有更大的权利。


Q: How do you think landscape urbanism projects working in a Chinese context with centralized governance and massive funding for development, as opposed to the distributed agency in US and European contexts?

A: The fact that the state sponsors major developments should mean landscape architects can have more power on a bigger scale.


小编:景观都市主义或者生态都市主义的下一个主义是什么?

韦勒教授:并没有下一个,这并不是一种时髦。生态都市主义需要几个世纪去实现。


Q: What’s next for the Landscape Urbanism and Ecological Urbanism? 

A: Nothing is next – this is not fashion. It will take centuries to make “ecological urbanism”.


小编:什么样的中国景观让你感兴趣并且感到兴奋?

韦勒教授:我想知道中国的年轻人都去哪里休闲娱乐的。我也想尝试从首都机场步行到商务中心区CBD,看看这是一种什么样的精神上的户外探险。


Q: What kind of landscape in China made you feel interesting and exciting? 

A: I’d like to know where the teenagers hangout. I’d also like to try and walk in a straight line from Beijing airport to the CBD and treat it like a spiritual, wilderness adventure.



图5:合影左一:GARLIC联合创始人周张侃,左二:GARLIC联合创始人景斯阳,左三:宾大设计学
城市规划系前系主任约翰·兰蒂斯(John· Landis), 右二:宾大设计学院院长玛丽莲·乔丹·泰勒(Marilyn Jordan Taylor), 右三:宾大设计学院景观与区域规划系系主任理查德·韦勒(Richard Weller)。图片来源:GARLIC




第四部分:好奇心

Part Four: Curiosity


小编:是什么样的品质让宾大景观项目与众不同?

韦勒教授:老师和对设计课作业的标准是最与众不同的。


Q: What quality makes the UPenn landscape architecture program different from the others?

A: The teachers and the standard of design work done in the studios are exceptional.


小编:您觉得怎样学生和青年设计师让您感到兴奋并会给他们来宾大学习的机会?

韦勒教授:我们需要少一些看上去漂亮的设计,需要多一些辩证思考和探索性的想法。


Q: What quality of student and young designers will make you feel excited and offering them opportunities to study at UPenn?

A: We need less nice design and more critical and experimental ideas.



图5:宾大韦勒教授、北大俞孔坚教授和宾大学生讨论京津冀区域规划设计课程方案。图片来源:GARLIC




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